The public Unions are a great place to start!
I think you need to describe what you mean because that could be read either way.
Unions for public workers you could consider conflict of interest, since the unions bribe using members monies to politicians for better pay/benefits/etc and the politicians give kick back by giving them better pay/benefits/etc in most cases.
The Federal government requiring a company to be a Union shops for many bidding jobs has also created a conflict of interest as well, since politicians get money from Unions.
I find Unions pointless and have destroyed many companies when the company was in trouble and the union would not give any help by reducing costs. How many Union members have been screwed by their own Union to maintain the status quo and lost their jobs.
NOW you're worried about a conflict of interest? Where were you when our former VP was still on Haliburton's payroll while in office?
Trade unions serve a purpose to help protect from safety issues and corporate greedy dogs ... who does the public unions need to be protected from'?? the public??? .. they are public servants. These folks in Wis have it better off as far as 401K and helath care benis than many private businesses. The proposed bill .. or maybe it is has passed by now is to limit the increase of wages and benis that are over the 'norm'. They can still get wage increases when there wages and benis go below the norm. Who decides what the norm is ... well they manage to that in my industry - they can't do that for publci servants too?
Why is it that every other business in America has had to stop or lower pay, asked workers to pay more for the ever increasing health care costs /.. but not the public servants? The local/sate and even federal govts are working in a deficit and these entities are knocking on the door of bankruptcy yet these folks say .. NO .. we want 'OURS' and screw everyone else .. raise the taxes to pay for my wage increases and nice health care benis ... everyone else has had to tighten their belts, but not the public unions. There is something wrong with this picture. You may argue that Wis really isn't that broke and can find other ways to cut expenses - but it's the gov and the legislatures prerogative - elected by the people of that state to do the job.
In Cali there are many public unions with retirement with full benis at age 55 .. criminy - is that crazy or what. They worked for 30 years, let's carry them on the books for another 35 years.
There are some tough decisions for taxpayers and governments to make in the near future .. it is better to make those decisions now instead of closing down all of govt and the institutions because there is no more money .. I think we can agree on that.
But they ARE agreeing to what, in effect, are pay cuts. The only reason to kill the unions is to kick the middle class one more time.
Its called labor busting folks, its not new and its not good..
Are you pretending the unions broke the country? Or even Wisconson? Because that wasnt true...
Even if it was, there are plenty of ways to pay for things. It all in the way you support, i dont support it coming out of the middle class American's pocket, others do. If it just comes out of the corpirations who are going off shore instead of hiring American workers. Or the overly rich who make more then most of us will see in several years (mind you even with more taxes these people would see more money in 1 year then the normal American would in 5)..
Ofcourse if some got the way they want we would have no unions, American workers would be payed shit with no benefits and everyone would hire American slave labor..
no .. politicians help bankrupt America... the public unions and the pensions that are not adequately funded are just part of the equation.. I suppose that was all on corporations too. Politicians say and do anything to remain professional politicians for the most part .. if that means robbing Peter to pay Paul.. no problem with that as long as Paul votes for you.
I'm not defending corporations anymore than I'm saying that unions are the root of all evil.
I am having a very hard time finding sympathy for public unions which have a monopoly on their job sector and are paid more handsomely for being public servants than the public themselves that work for private business or corporations. Public unions which do not sponsor competiveness or rewards doing an excellent job - these breeds medicority and complacency.
Retiring with full benefits at age 50 is ludicrous, yet so many public union workers are doing that I have two acquaintances that have retired with full benis with very nice pay - one is a prison guard and the other is a policeman. Their pensions are 'guaranteed' by some stupid politicians and they have some very nice price of inflation raises each year too ... much more than people in the real business world enjoy.
Frop ... I was watching a show on India yesterday - there were small time scum .. not corporations that were stealing kids and making them work int he fields .. shoot people are just plain greedy for the most part - it's not just corporations. Look at the unions - you're telling me that they are not being greedy in their negotiations.. childish .. and that they are being reasonable? TO see the mess and debris that the unions 'protesters' left in the city area is pretty disgusting - to cost over $7 million to clean up.
I have 4 kids and my biggest fears is not corporations screwing the youth over, but politicians that can't balance a budget and have put them all in a sea of debt that they did not even incur. Politicians that give money to Central banks and financial institutions, politicians that allow the oligarchy to steal from the public while they in turn give money to the politicians to get elected. What part of this to unions hold - well - look at the political power and resources that they yield and the union members don't even get to vote where their dues go. Politicians can pit one economic class against another with their tax brackets and it is quite the topic of debate these days. I find it incredulous that almost 1/2 of the tax payers don't pay any federal income taxes - and these same people will complain that the rich aren't paying their fair share. Too many people looking for a free ride .. unions that want theirs and they don't care what it costs and not enough 'honest' regulation from the federal govt.
A republic, if you can keep it - Benjamin Franklin
I have a 3 month old daughter, I do not want corporate America to make it be OK for her, or any other child, to work 16 hours a day 6 days a week when she is 7 years old. I support solidarity among the workers, because without the union and collective bargaining rights, I have no doubt that big money will make things like that legal again.
Let's see if we can connect some dots.
Conservatives HATE union workers, for all kinds of reasons. Conservatives applaud the importation of foreign workers who will work cheaper than Americans. Conservatives support giving tax incentives to outsource American jobs overseas, presumably to get the work done cheaper. Conservatives aren't thrilled about anyone who earns a paycheck that comes from tax money, which includes teachers, cops, firefighters, gov'ment office workers, social workers and so forth because they are overpaid and under-worked and because they are a drain on tax dollars that would be better spent giving tax cuts to those earning over $1 million net income.
Could it be that conservatives just don't care for middle income earners at all? They seem to have nothing but contempt for anyone who works for a living that isn't a corporate lawyer or in upper management of a company that gives generously to the GOP for campaign contributions.
And, it might just be a coincidence, but since their point of view has been the driving force behind the government since 1981, wages have stalled for just about everyone in the Middle Class since that time, while earnings at the top of the scale have skyrocketed.
Connect the dots ... to fill in the rest of your make believe world
There is nothing make believe about the statistics. Corrected for inflation, most middle class jobs pay the same that they did in the late 1970's.
That is for those who still have jobs.
In the same time period, executive pay has exploded and continues to accelerate.
That is the real world, the one we live in. Redistribution of wealth is a reality. It was redistributed upward.
In Wisconsin right now, teachers are about to be paid less to cover the costs for more tax cuts. Less income for middle income earners, more for those who get the cuts, mostly upper income earners.
Not only is this the actual, real reality, but it is happening right in front of you yet you somehow don't see it.
You can thank the spin machine for that.
And you are going to blame conservatives for the rich getting richer ... come on Gramps - can your world be so black and white as to actually believe this? It's called greed and that being one of the deadly sins - I think it pretty much encompasses the the people in this world unfortuantley.
There are lot's of reasons for the shrinking middle class and the rich are getting richer.
A middle-class comeback depends on a healthy and growing economy that creates more jobs and money for everybody, and then the lower and middle earners able to capture a share of this ... now look at who bailed out the rich and richest in America and look at how unions of driven off jobs to foreign country's. Look who got the exemptions not to have to follow Obamacare laws ... Look how the govt has increased hiring in the govt and not in private business. Govt is not an efficient way to do business.
Comparing Private Sector and Government Worker Salaries
Yes we can thank the spin machine for spinning this whole .. conservatives are Nazi's and they are killing unions and stomping on the little people rhetoric.
Next election vote'm out .. I'm pretty sure you will vote for the same folks that put your city/county/state/country in a burdensome debt and beholden to foreign country.
There will be some interesting special elections in Cali this next month or so - this state is run by Democrats from top to bottom now - they won't be able to blame the gubernator for the problems that Gray Davis and the unions had created in what used to be a state ranked to have the 8th largest economy in the world. Interesting to watch indeed.
I didn't say conservatives are the only cause for this situation but their point of view is the one that has prevailed for most of the past 30 years.
And I disagree that the unions are totally responsible for sending jobs overseas. Doesn't the management of these companies have any say so in what goes on in their companies? Some of these people make a $100 million a year, they must DO SOMETHING besides let the unions ruin everything. For example the auto unions get blamed for lagging US auto sales, but do the unions design and market these cars besides making them? According to this spin version of the story (and spin it is) no one has any responsibility for ANYTHING in American business besides unionized workers, and their lazy, overpaid, non-unionized counterparts. In that warped view, it makes sense to outsource American jobs to India and China, and let undocumented Mexicans work for scraps. That will solve all our problems.
notfark
America has begun its descent into fascism....